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	<title>Comments on: Nameless Tutorial #9</title>
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	<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/nameless_tutorial_9/</link>
	<description>How to start a clothing line or run the one you have, better.</description>
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		<title>By: Meghan</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/nameless_tutorial_9/comment-page-1/#comment-12269</link>
		<dc:creator>Meghan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Jan 2009 01:16:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/2006/01/nameless_tutorial_9/#comment-12269</guid>
		<description>I love this post! I worked for a tailor who was old and European and firmly entrenched in his old ways of doing things. Even to my relatively untrained eye the way he did some things was not the smart way. His response to my suggestions was always &#039; this is how you do it, because this is how I learned&#039;. I hope that tailoring catches up with the times as the current generation of old guys pass it on to young people who will think critically about what they have been taught.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love this post! I worked for a tailor who was old and European and firmly entrenched in his old ways of doing things. Even to my relatively untrained eye the way he did some things was not the smart way. His response to my suggestions was always &#8216; this is how you do it, because this is how I learned&#8217;. I hope that tailoring catches up with the times as the current generation of old guys pass it on to young people who will think critically about what they have been taught.</p>
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		<title>By: LauraLo</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/nameless_tutorial_9/comment-page-1/#comment-11282</link>
		<dc:creator>LauraLo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Oct 2008 13:01:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/2006/01/nameless_tutorial_9/#comment-11282</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m wondering if any of the people expressing various doubts above have actually tried Kathleen&#039;s method of bagging a jacket. Because I did. Actually, as soon as I saw the photos in the nameless tutorial series, I wanted to try it - I mean, come on, like which of the photos would you like your garment to look?? Since I first try it, I never made another coat without using Kathleen&#039;s bagging method. What attracted me to this method (besides the clean look in the photo, besides my admiration for Kathleen) was that it is a simple and logical solution! It is so easy and it gives you such great results. 
The reason I&#039;m writing this comment (other than expressing my gratitude to Kathleen for sharing her knowledge) is that I&#039;ve just tried this method coupled with drafting my own facings and linings, as Kathleen describes it in her book. Guess what? She&#039;s right, you don&#039;t need that hem pleat! Not at all, not if you draft your lining as she describes (which is another example of clear and logical solution). You can go at my blog and read this post - http://laurasewingroom.blogspot.com/2008/10/white-and-black-trenchcoat.html 
See in this - http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_e2XwlkD5wb0/SOSL6BtQdCI/AAAAAAAABUw/91wu4r4sjb4/s1600-h/DSCN0019.JPG - picture where the trench is on a hanger, how the lining &quot;blouses&quot; at the hem? This shows you there is more than enough ease in the lining to accommodate the posture and movement of your body, but not as much as to form that obnoxious pleat. I always hated that pleat, it was such a pain to iron, I never knew exactly how much I should fold when ironing it and when wearing, the pleat unfolded a bit, showing a well-pressed crease at the hem of my jacket. 
Believe me, I&#039;ll never make another coat, jacket whatever, using another method. I&#039;m a home sewer and indeed us home sewers are so easily convinced by commercial patternmakers to make up for their mistakes in patterndrafting by handsewing or using various shortcuts. I&#039;m willing to invest my (limited) time and energy in handsewing, but only if it gives added value to my garment. Why should I finish by handsewing  a lining which is inserted by machine? It would make more sense to insert the entire lining by hand or to make the entire garment by hand, right? At least it would be consistent. 
So, Kathleen, thank you. You certainly made me very-very happy with this tutorial and your book. If you ever publish another one (book), here&#039;s somebody who will buy it instantly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m wondering if any of the people expressing various doubts above have actually tried Kathleen&#8217;s method of bagging a jacket. Because I did. Actually, as soon as I saw the photos in the nameless tutorial series, I wanted to try it &#8211; I mean, come on, like which of the photos would you like your garment to look?? Since I first try it, I never made another coat without using Kathleen&#8217;s bagging method. What attracted me to this method (besides the clean look in the photo, besides my admiration for Kathleen) was that it is a simple and logical solution! It is so easy and it gives you such great results.<br />
The reason I&#8217;m writing this comment (other than expressing my gratitude to Kathleen for sharing her knowledge) is that I&#8217;ve just tried this method coupled with drafting my own facings and linings, as Kathleen describes it in her book. Guess what? She&#8217;s right, you don&#8217;t need that hem pleat! Not at all, not if you draft your lining as she describes (which is another example of clear and logical solution). You can go at my blog and read this post &#8211; <a href="http://laurasewingroom.blogspot.com/2008/10/white-and-black-trenchcoat.html" rel="nofollow">http://laurasewingroom.blogspot.com/2008/10/white-and-black-trenchcoat.html</a><br />
See in this &#8211; <a href="http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_e2XwlkD5wb0/SOSL6BtQdCI/AAAAAAAABUw/91wu4r4sjb4/s1600-h/DSCN0019.JPG" rel="nofollow">http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_e2XwlkD5wb0/SOSL6BtQdCI/AAAAAAAABUw/91wu4r4sjb4/s1600-h/DSCN0019.JPG</a> &#8211; picture where the trench is on a hanger, how the lining &#8220;blouses&#8221; at the hem? This shows you there is more than enough ease in the lining to accommodate the posture and movement of your body, but not as much as to form that obnoxious pleat. I always hated that pleat, it was such a pain to iron, I never knew exactly how much I should fold when ironing it and when wearing, the pleat unfolded a bit, showing a well-pressed crease at the hem of my jacket.<br />
Believe me, I&#8217;ll never make another coat, jacket whatever, using another method. I&#8217;m a home sewer and indeed us home sewers are so easily convinced by commercial patternmakers to make up for their mistakes in patterndrafting by handsewing or using various shortcuts. I&#8217;m willing to invest my (limited) time and energy in handsewing, but only if it gives added value to my garment. Why should I finish by handsewing  a lining which is inserted by machine? It would make more sense to insert the entire lining by hand or to make the entire garment by hand, right? At least it would be consistent.<br />
So, Kathleen, thank you. You certainly made me very-very happy with this tutorial and your book. If you ever publish another one (book), here&#8217;s somebody who will buy it instantly.</p>
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		<title>By: deerskin</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/nameless_tutorial_9/comment-page-1/#comment-1882</link>
		<dc:creator>deerskin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jan 2006 23:15:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/2006/01/nameless_tutorial_9/#comment-1882</guid>
		<description>Jinjer,

I asked about who does the embroidery because i am interested in the whole process of manufacturing. So yes, it does matter to me. I would think since this site is about garment manufacture that it might be useful info for others--sort of the rule i have about questions in my classes--is it just personal or will others benefit from the info?
Obviously, or maybe not, i know how things happen in a commercial costume shop, but for garment manufacturing--in best practices, lean kind of way--i am sort of clueless. So . . . call me stupid. But i don&#039;t think my question was.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jinjer,</p>
<p>I asked about who does the embroidery because i am interested in the whole process of manufacturing. So yes, it does matter to me. I would think since this site is about garment manufacture that it might be useful info for others&#8211;sort of the rule i have about questions in my classes&#8211;is it just personal or will others benefit from the info?<br />
Obviously, or maybe not, i know how things happen in a commercial costume shop, but for garment manufacturing&#8211;in best practices, lean kind of way&#8211;i am sort of clueless. So . . . call me stupid. But i don&#8217;t think my question was.</p>
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		<title>By: Jinjer Markley</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/nameless_tutorial_9/comment-page-1/#comment-1881</link>
		<dc:creator>Jinjer Markley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jan 2006 22:53:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/2006/01/nameless_tutorial_9/#comment-1881</guid>
		<description>Does it matter whether the same person did the lining embroidery? I thought the point was, is the hand-stitchg valuable, regardless of who did it, or when it was done.

Also re: China (but kinda OT), I find it really really fascinating that the Chinese invented mass-production long before Britain. Chinese potters have been using mass production techniques like division of labor for millennia.  One interesting innovation was the design of cups that could be stacked more easily in a kiln, so they could get more pottery out of their investment in the fuel &amp; time required to fire them. This almost seems lean...:)
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Does it matter whether the same person did the lining embroidery? I thought the point was, is the hand-stitchg valuable, regardless of who did it, or when it was done.</p>
<p>Also re: China (but kinda OT), I find it really really fascinating that the Chinese invented mass-production long before Britain. Chinese potters have been using mass production techniques like division of labor for millennia.  One interesting innovation was the design of cups that could be stacked more easily in a kiln, so they could get more pottery out of their investment in the fuel &#038; time required to fire them. This almost seems lean&#8230;:)</p>
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		<title>By: deerskin</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/nameless_tutorial_9/comment-page-1/#comment-1880</link>
		<dc:creator>deerskin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jan 2006 16:38:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/2006/01/nameless_tutorial_9/#comment-1880</guid>
		<description>Call me stupid, but would one person really make the whole coat, including the embroidery? In the costume industry embroidery and other surface design is a specialized skill and would be done separately from the construction. The pattern of the garment would be marked out and the embroidery pattern marked out on the fabric and then sent to the embroiderers (or fabric painters or etc.) inhouse or contracted. Once that&#039;s done then the markings gets check for accuracy--(stuff usually shrinks when it&#039;s painted) then constructed.
Of course there are times when surface design is done after construction but that&#039;s, for the most part, only at the Metropolitan Opera, because they don&#039;t have a dedicated fabric painter but use someone who also paints sets--at least that&#039;s the way it used to be.

I also ask because the embroidery looks like tambour work, which has to be done on a frame.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Call me stupid, but would one person really make the whole coat, including the embroidery? In the costume industry embroidery and other surface design is a specialized skill and would be done separately from the construction. The pattern of the garment would be marked out and the embroidery pattern marked out on the fabric and then sent to the embroiderers (or fabric painters or etc.) inhouse or contracted. Once that&#8217;s done then the markings gets check for accuracy&#8211;(stuff usually shrinks when it&#8217;s painted) then constructed.<br />
Of course there are times when surface design is done after construction but that&#8217;s, for the most part, only at the Metropolitan Opera, because they don&#8217;t have a dedicated fabric painter but use someone who also paints sets&#8211;at least that&#8217;s the way it used to be.</p>
<p>I also ask because the embroidery looks like tambour work, which has to be done on a frame.</p>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/nameless_tutorial_9/comment-page-1/#comment-1879</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jan 2006 14:06:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/2006/01/nameless_tutorial_9/#comment-1879</guid>
		<description>It is interesting that a man or woman in Hong Kong did this nice work in the 50s, and current sewing books are still showing us how to do the lining-facing-hem juncture in a variety of sloppy ways, and the apparel industry is turning out similar work today. I wonder why. Great looking coat. Thanks. Bob

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is interesting that a man or woman in Hong Kong did this nice work in the 50s, and current sewing books are still showing us how to do the lining-facing-hem juncture in a variety of sloppy ways, and the apparel industry is turning out similar work today. I wonder why. Great looking coat. Thanks. Bob</p>
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		<title>By: Eric H</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/nameless_tutorial_9/comment-page-1/#comment-1878</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric H</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jan 2006 01:09:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/2006/01/nameless_tutorial_9/#comment-1878</guid>
		<description>I guess I don&#039;t even understand why this is controversial.  If you have to pull it off the machine and interrupt the flow of work to pull out a needle to finish as in the 2nd photo above, it needlessly adds cost.  It also needlessly slows down the laborer, who is presumably being paid piece rate.  And as someone who has bought coats, (A) I would not have known it was hand-stitched, nor (B) understood the jacket in the 2nd photo to be superior in any way because of the hand-stitching.  So it&#039;s an less profitable, inferior product that reduces stitcher productivity and income - that&#039;s lose-lose-lose.

On the other hand, though it&#039;s nothing I would ever buy, I clearly see the value added in the hand-stitched Chinese jacket.

There&#039;s something here that I think people frequently have a difficult time understanding.  On the one hand, you have people who always believe that cost is everything and you should always buy the cheapest product.  On the other, you have people that believe that quality is everything and you should always buy the best product.  If everyone were in the former camp, the VW air-cooled Beetle would only have the Yugo as competition, and if everyone were in the latter camp, the few people who could afford them would drive Mercedes and Ferraris.  Clearly, something else is in play.  People tend to buy the best value, by which I mean the ratio between features and price.

There is a tension: customers want the most features within their budget but producers want to keep their costs low but their selling price high which means they have a tension between reducing or adding features.  They can&#039;t add features willy-nilly because what one person regards as a valuable feature, another regards as valueless.  They have to add features that people are willing to pay for.  To me, the hand stitching in the 2nd photo is valueless, and I would guess 99% of all men who buy these coats would agree.  The hand-stitching in the beautiful coat is clearly an added value, and for people who recognize and desire it, they gladly pay more for it.  Since few can do that kind of work, the person doing it makes more.  That&#039;s win-win-win.  But it&#039;s also win-win-win when you make a good quality product with superior, low-cost processes.

As I usually summarize it, &quot;cheap&quot; and &quot;low cost&quot; do not have identical meanings.

Regarding deerskin&#039;s comments, I concede that she has a potential point, but I suspect that the data will not prove it out.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I guess I don&#8217;t even understand why this is controversial.  If you have to pull it off the machine and interrupt the flow of work to pull out a needle to finish as in the 2nd photo above, it needlessly adds cost.  It also needlessly slows down the laborer, who is presumably being paid piece rate.  And as someone who has bought coats, (A) I would not have known it was hand-stitched, nor (B) understood the jacket in the 2nd photo to be superior in any way because of the hand-stitching.  So it&#8217;s an less profitable, inferior product that reduces stitcher productivity and income &#8211; that&#8217;s lose-lose-lose.</p>
<p>On the other hand, though it&#8217;s nothing I would ever buy, I clearly see the value added in the hand-stitched Chinese jacket.</p>
<p>There&#8217;s something here that I think people frequently have a difficult time understanding.  On the one hand, you have people who always believe that cost is everything and you should always buy the cheapest product.  On the other, you have people that believe that quality is everything and you should always buy the best product.  If everyone were in the former camp, the VW air-cooled Beetle would only have the Yugo as competition, and if everyone were in the latter camp, the few people who could afford them would drive Mercedes and Ferraris.  Clearly, something else is in play.  People tend to buy the best value, by which I mean the ratio between features and price.</p>
<p>There is a tension: customers want the most features within their budget but producers want to keep their costs low but their selling price high which means they have a tension between reducing or adding features.  They can&#8217;t add features willy-nilly because what one person regards as a valuable feature, another regards as valueless.  They have to add features that people are willing to pay for.  To me, the hand stitching in the 2nd photo is valueless, and I would guess 99% of all men who buy these coats would agree.  The hand-stitching in the beautiful coat is clearly an added value, and for people who recognize and desire it, they gladly pay more for it.  Since few can do that kind of work, the person doing it makes more.  That&#8217;s win-win-win.  But it&#8217;s also win-win-win when you make a good quality product with superior, low-cost processes.</p>
<p>As I usually summarize it, &#8220;cheap&#8221; and &#8220;low cost&#8221; do not have identical meanings.</p>
<p>Regarding deerskin&#8217;s comments, I concede that she has a potential point, but I suspect that the data will not prove it out.</p>
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		<title>By: deerskin</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/nameless_tutorial_9/comment-page-1/#comment-1877</link>
		<dc:creator>deerskin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Jan 2006 19:11:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/2006/01/nameless_tutorial_9/#comment-1877</guid>
		<description>Of course as the nay-saying voice quoted above, whenever i see these photos i really want to be able to feel the bulk and look inside to check the seaming out etc.
But answers to questions will just have to satisfy me.
1) is the edge of the facing bound with the satin? or is that a piped edge or . . . ?
2) which way did the seam allowance of the facing and lining seam get pressed--lining side or facing side.

This is a wonderful coat--loved to see what the outside looks like.

Also, just for the record, i have never thought that you/Kathleen don&#039;t/doesn&#039;t like hand stitching. For me, your/her position about hand-vs-machine appropriateness has always been clear.

So like i mentioned before, i will do a sample of a heavier fabric with Kathleen&#039;s technique and report back. With photos. I promise by the weekend--unless i get sick.

And i don&#039;t even want to get into the handsewing vs machine sewing appropriateness for construction as in if you can do it by machine, why do it by hand? That might get ugly. If anyone needs more info, since you have a hint above, you can read my comments on earlier parts of this tutorial--i think they are still there. Or here it is in a nutshell.
Hand sewing-like
Machine sewing-like
Bulky bumps-no like . . . i.e. construction that results in bulky bumps, whether by hand sewing, machine sewing, barge cement, staples etc.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course as the nay-saying voice quoted above, whenever i see these photos i really want to be able to feel the bulk and look inside to check the seaming out etc.<br />
But answers to questions will just have to satisfy me.<br />
1) is the edge of the facing bound with the satin? or is that a piped edge or . . . ?<br />
2) which way did the seam allowance of the facing and lining seam get pressed&#8211;lining side or facing side.</p>
<p>This is a wonderful coat&#8211;loved to see what the outside looks like.</p>
<p>Also, just for the record, i have never thought that you/Kathleen don&#8217;t/doesn&#8217;t like hand stitching. For me, your/her position about hand-vs-machine appropriateness has always been clear.</p>
<p>So like i mentioned before, i will do a sample of a heavier fabric with Kathleen&#8217;s technique and report back. With photos. I promise by the weekend&#8211;unless i get sick.</p>
<p>And i don&#8217;t even want to get into the handsewing vs machine sewing appropriateness for construction as in if you can do it by machine, why do it by hand? That might get ugly. If anyone needs more info, since you have a hint above, you can read my comments on earlier parts of this tutorial&#8211;i think they are still there. Or here it is in a nutshell.<br />
Hand sewing-like<br />
Machine sewing-like<br />
Bulky bumps-no like . . . i.e. construction that results in bulky bumps, whether by hand sewing, machine sewing, barge cement, staples etc.</p>
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		<title>By: Maija</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/nameless_tutorial_9/comment-page-1/#comment-1876</link>
		<dc:creator>Maija</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Jan 2006 17:27:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/2006/01/nameless_tutorial_9/#comment-1876</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve been following this tutorial with great interest.  This morning as I was getting ready for work, I noticed that the lining of my jacket (from a &quot;big box&quot; chain&#039;s private label) is finished just as all of Kathleen&#039;s &quot;good&quot;  examples are.  If nothing else, this shows that the recommended method is reproducible for any price point, from a $30 jacket to the costly vintage example above.  On the other hand, I doubt that the time-consuming handwork required for the workaround examples would make economic sense for big box price points.  I think that&#039;s one good indication of this  method&#039;s validity as &quot;Standard Work&quot;.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve been following this tutorial with great interest.  This morning as I was getting ready for work, I noticed that the lining of my jacket (from a &#8220;big box&#8221; chain&#8217;s private label) is finished just as all of Kathleen&#8217;s &#8220;good&#8221;  examples are.  If nothing else, this shows that the recommended method is reproducible for any price point, from a $30 jacket to the costly vintage example above.  On the other hand, I doubt that the time-consuming handwork required for the workaround examples would make economic sense for big box price points.  I think that&#8217;s one good indication of this  method&#8217;s validity as &#8220;Standard Work&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Jess Latham</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/nameless_tutorial_9/comment-page-1/#comment-1875</link>
		<dc:creator>Jess Latham</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Jan 2006 17:04:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/2006/01/nameless_tutorial_9/#comment-1875</guid>
		<description>If you want to see lots of gorgeous clothes with things done by hand that add quality see the Feb issue of Vogue and The Handmade&#039;s Tale spread.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you want to see lots of gorgeous clothes with things done by hand that add quality see the Feb issue of Vogue and The Handmade&#8217;s Tale spread.</p>
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