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	<title>Comments on: Prototype bag Style# 4216 &amp; 4217</title>
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	<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/prototype-bag-style-4216-4217/</link>
	<description>How to start a clothing line or run the one you have, better.</description>
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		<title>By: How to start a homebased handmade sewing business</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/prototype-bag-style-4216-4217/comment-page-1/#comment-15922</link>
		<dc:creator>How to start a homebased handmade sewing business</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Jul 2009 20:53:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/?p=4518#comment-15922</guid>
		<description>[...] prototype to production sewing Going from prototype to production sewing pt.2 Design Paralysis pt.2 Prototype bag Style# 4216 &amp; 4217.  addthis_pub = [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] prototype to production sewing Going from prototype to production sewing pt.2 Design Paralysis pt.2 Prototype bag Style# 4216 &#038; 4217.  addthis_pub = [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Elaine Good</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/prototype-bag-style-4216-4217/comment-page-1/#comment-15830</link>
		<dc:creator>Elaine Good</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Jul 2009 05:12:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/?p=4518#comment-15830</guid>
		<description>&quot;...guess how they do this in the leather trades (bootmakers etc)? Believe it or not, they cut all those shapes out by hand, glue them (I’m shrieking) and then they stitch them down. Sheer insanity if you ask me when there’s much easier ways to do it....&quot;

I worked in a leather shop many, many years ago and yes, that&#039;s how they taught us to do it! So, what&#039;s the easier way?

And yes, I&#039;m interested in the pattern design process also.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;&#8230;guess how they do this in the leather trades (bootmakers etc)? Believe it or not, they cut all those shapes out by hand, glue them (I’m shrieking) and then they stitch them down. Sheer insanity if you ask me when there’s much easier ways to do it&#8230;.&#8221;</p>
<p>I worked in a leather shop many, many years ago and yes, that&#8217;s how they taught us to do it! So, what&#8217;s the easier way?</p>
<p>And yes, I&#8217;m interested in the pattern design process also.</p>
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		<title>By: Susan</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/prototype-bag-style-4216-4217/comment-page-1/#comment-15802</link>
		<dc:creator>Susan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Jul 2009 19:40:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/?p=4518#comment-15802</guid>
		<description>I love both bags.  And love Amy&#039;s idea of a dress.

I don&#039;t think the sun design is plagerism.  Their are way too many sunburst designs dating back eons to the Chinese and Egyptians to name a few for this to be plagerism.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love both bags.  And love Amy&#8217;s idea of a dress.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think the sun design is plagerism.  Their are way too many sunburst designs dating back eons to the Chinese and Egyptians to name a few for this to be plagerism.</p>
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		<title>By: Faye</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/prototype-bag-style-4216-4217/comment-page-1/#comment-15799</link>
		<dc:creator>Faye</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Jul 2009 19:01:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/?p=4518#comment-15799</guid>
		<description>Very helpful lesson/explanation of pattern construction.  It is fascinating to me actually and it is the type of lesson I would pay for in a course or subscription set up.

These are cool patterns Kathleen.  I really love your variation on the smoke jacket!  I would buy this bag in spring brights such as yellow, orange or grass green, and in tanned brown and black.  I know you have a target market and that these colors would be harder to source but that could be a whole other project - doing custom, made-to-order bags.

With style 4217, I was thinking what about trying to make the top and middle layers detachable/reversible so that customers can have a variety of color choices, especially if the bottom layer is a solid color.  This style would look really good in a solid dark brown or tan. I don&#039;t know about mixing/pairing colors like red with white or black, especially for this bag but I am someone who likes bright accessories.

On the other hand, the pattern and construction of these bags alone are so strong that maybe there can be a way to offer custom/made to order options for colors that are not available in the main line.  I keep saying this but I do enjoy this series.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very helpful lesson/explanation of pattern construction.  It is fascinating to me actually and it is the type of lesson I would pay for in a course or subscription set up.</p>
<p>These are cool patterns Kathleen.  I really love your variation on the smoke jacket!  I would buy this bag in spring brights such as yellow, orange or grass green, and in tanned brown and black.  I know you have a target market and that these colors would be harder to source but that could be a whole other project &#8211; doing custom, made-to-order bags.</p>
<p>With style 4217, I was thinking what about trying to make the top and middle layers detachable/reversible so that customers can have a variety of color choices, especially if the bottom layer is a solid color.  This style would look really good in a solid dark brown or tan. I don&#8217;t know about mixing/pairing colors like red with white or black, especially for this bag but I am someone who likes bright accessories.</p>
<p>On the other hand, the pattern and construction of these bags alone are so strong that maybe there can be a way to offer custom/made to order options for colors that are not available in the main line.  I keep saying this but I do enjoy this series.</p>
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		<title>By: Connie</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/prototype-bag-style-4216-4217/comment-page-1/#comment-15789</link>
		<dc:creator>Connie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Jul 2009 17:23:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/?p=4518#comment-15789</guid>
		<description>I like Amy&#039;s idea of turning the black purse into a dress!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like Amy&#8217;s idea of turning the black purse into a dress!</p>
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		<title>By: Kathleen</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/prototype-bag-style-4216-4217/comment-page-1/#comment-15784</link>
		<dc:creator>Kathleen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Jul 2009 17:13:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/?p=4518#comment-15784</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Just a guess as to the reason for numbering the pattern pieces&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Good eye Marian! Actually, the numbering of each piece (1-7) is the one reason I hesitated to post the photo of the pattern because as you know, we don&#039;t number individual patterns (in this way) in industry. Sure, they&#039;re often numbered with a &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/pn_numbers/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;PN numbering system&lt;/a&gt; but we never use a number instead of a piece name. 

In brief, the pieces were numbered because they could not be named in an orderly fashion according to &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archives/piece_naming_conventions/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;piece naming conventions&lt;/a&gt;. Imo, a pattern like this would require a pictograph, ideally on each pattern piece which I&#039;ve done before (it was wildly popular). 

It isn&#039;t important that each piece be cut in order &lt;b&gt;in leather&lt;/b&gt;. It is important that each pattern piece be cut in order in the pattern process tho. 

For example, a beginner should start with piece #1, cutting it out and notching it. Then you lay piece #1 on top of the seam line to which it sews of piece #2 to make sure piece #2 matches piece #1. 

If someone is more experienced, you cut out all of the pieces in the order you please but I would not notch them. Not yet. I would notch piece #1, then lay it to its seam line on piece #2, trace off the notch and then notch it. I&#039;d also double check the seam line and trim off any minuscule overhang (amounting to 1/32nd or 1/64th&quot;). I repeat the process until all pieces are notched. 

Another thing I do in this phase is to true off the ends of the seam allowance to match the piece onto which it is paired. That sounds too complicated to make sense of. I realize I need to illustrate it.

A step previous to this, still the drafting phase, I rarely trace straight lines even if the piece to be copied has &quot;straight&quot; lines. The reason is, few lines drafted perfectly straight end up cut that way. Or at least I can&#039;t. I don&#039;t cut so well, particularly not lately, my eyes are getting worse. Still, I&#039;ve always done it this way, it&#039;s an ingrained habit. I draw anew, on each piece, all straight lines with a ruler. That way, if there&#039;s an error in the piece I&#039;ve traced, the error will not be passed onto the new piece -which may end up with it&#039;s own wonky edge.

But, indirectly returning to your point Marian, it doesn&#039;t matter the order in which you cut the pieces out in leather. The only thing that matters is nap (note the arrows point down). Which reminds me of another arcane pet peeve, how grain lines are often misused. The arrows mean something. If you have only one arrow, that indicates the direction in which the nap lies. If there&#039;s two arrows, this means it doesn&#039;t matter in which direction you lay the piece (no nap or directional pattern). If there are no arrows at all (typical in industrial patterns), it means the same as if there were two arrows. While I&#039;m ragging on this topic (should I do a short entry on this?), it is really really annoying if the grain line does not extend to the end (edges) of each pattern piece IF it&#039;s a hard copy pattern. Not that I ever fail to do this, heh. I&#039;m not always good about it on leather but I&#039;m a bear about it when it comes to match stripes. It&#039;s aggravating to have to draw the rest of the grainline to make a new one, lay it on stripes, or to grade it. Full size grain lines are unimportant on markers tho, there&#039;s a difference.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Just a guess as to the reason for numbering the pattern pieces</p></blockquote>
<p>Good eye Marian! Actually, the numbering of each piece (1-7) is the one reason I hesitated to post the photo of the pattern because as you know, we don&#8217;t number individual patterns (in this way) in industry. Sure, they&#8217;re often numbered with a <a href="http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/pn_numbers/" rel="nofollow">PN numbering system</a> but we never use a number instead of a piece name. </p>
<p>In brief, the pieces were numbered because they could not be named in an orderly fashion according to <a href="http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archives/piece_naming_conventions/" rel="nofollow">piece naming conventions</a>. Imo, a pattern like this would require a pictograph, ideally on each pattern piece which I&#8217;ve done before (it was wildly popular). </p>
<p>It isn&#8217;t important that each piece be cut in order <b>in leather</b>. It is important that each pattern piece be cut in order in the pattern process tho. </p>
<p>For example, a beginner should start with piece #1, cutting it out and notching it. Then you lay piece #1 on top of the seam line to which it sews of piece #2 to make sure piece #2 matches piece #1. </p>
<p>If someone is more experienced, you cut out all of the pieces in the order you please but I would not notch them. Not yet. I would notch piece #1, then lay it to its seam line on piece #2, trace off the notch and then notch it. I&#8217;d also double check the seam line and trim off any minuscule overhang (amounting to 1/32nd or 1/64th&#8221;). I repeat the process until all pieces are notched. </p>
<p>Another thing I do in this phase is to true off the ends of the seam allowance to match the piece onto which it is paired. That sounds too complicated to make sense of. I realize I need to illustrate it.</p>
<p>A step previous to this, still the drafting phase, I rarely trace straight lines even if the piece to be copied has &#8220;straight&#8221; lines. The reason is, few lines drafted perfectly straight end up cut that way. Or at least I can&#8217;t. I don&#8217;t cut so well, particularly not lately, my eyes are getting worse. Still, I&#8217;ve always done it this way, it&#8217;s an ingrained habit. I draw anew, on each piece, all straight lines with a ruler. That way, if there&#8217;s an error in the piece I&#8217;ve traced, the error will not be passed onto the new piece -which may end up with it&#8217;s own wonky edge.</p>
<p>But, indirectly returning to your point Marian, it doesn&#8217;t matter the order in which you cut the pieces out in leather. The only thing that matters is nap (note the arrows point down). Which reminds me of another arcane pet peeve, how grain lines are often misused. The arrows mean something. If you have only one arrow, that indicates the direction in which the nap lies. If there&#8217;s two arrows, this means it doesn&#8217;t matter in which direction you lay the piece (no nap or directional pattern). If there are no arrows at all (typical in industrial patterns), it means the same as if there were two arrows. While I&#8217;m ragging on this topic (should I do a short entry on this?), it is really really annoying if the grain line does not extend to the end (edges) of each pattern piece IF it&#8217;s a hard copy pattern. Not that I ever fail to do this, heh. I&#8217;m not always good about it on leather but I&#8217;m a bear about it when it comes to match stripes. It&#8217;s aggravating to have to draw the rest of the grainline to make a new one, lay it on stripes, or to grade it. Full size grain lines are unimportant on markers tho, there&#8217;s a difference.</p>
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		<title>By: Marian</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/prototype-bag-style-4216-4217/comment-page-1/#comment-15781</link>
		<dc:creator>Marian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Jul 2009 16:36:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/?p=4518#comment-15781</guid>
		<description>Just a guess as to the reason for numbering the pattern pieces:  when you work with leather and have to work around rough spots, you would probably want to cut the biggest pieces first and then fit the little ones around in the places that are left.   So you number the pieces in the order in which they should be cut. (?)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just a guess as to the reason for numbering the pattern pieces:  when you work with leather and have to work around rough spots, you would probably want to cut the biggest pieces first and then fit the little ones around in the places that are left.   So you number the pieces in the order in which they should be cut. (?)</p>
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		<title>By: Kaaren</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/prototype-bag-style-4216-4217/comment-page-1/#comment-15780</link>
		<dc:creator>Kaaren</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Jul 2009 16:13:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/?p=4518#comment-15780</guid>
		<description>I love this series. I believe all your concepts are beautiful, have merit and marketability.

Personal Preferences follows IF that matters and maybe it should not. I am probably not your demographic as I am an older woman, who is a conservative if somewhat bland dresser. Some if not most of my designs are best suited for someone else, I spend little time designing something for me even though I produce my entire wardrobe.  I have to force myself to up the ante on my own clothing and accessories.

I especially like the flame pattern - 3 layers of overlay provide a lot of texture, structure and expense even in soft hides. Love the drama! I am even more partial to the underlay concept-with just one extra layer of contrast hide, which I think would be softer, (cheaper/faster) with fewer layers to cut and stitch.

The smoke jacket in one natural color knocks me out. I like the clean lines and natural design. It is dynamic yet subtle.  I reach for subtle over bling every time.

Can we see a picture of the proto bag on the shoulder? The straps concern me, not sure if its placement or width or just that it is out of context as in not on the body. If the bag is near full, how do the straps fit and balance on a narrow shoulder?

Cant wait to see the next installment.
Kaaren</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love this series. I believe all your concepts are beautiful, have merit and marketability.</p>
<p>Personal Preferences follows IF that matters and maybe it should not. I am probably not your demographic as I am an older woman, who is a conservative if somewhat bland dresser. Some if not most of my designs are best suited for someone else, I spend little time designing something for me even though I produce my entire wardrobe.  I have to force myself to up the ante on my own clothing and accessories.</p>
<p>I especially like the flame pattern &#8211; 3 layers of overlay provide a lot of texture, structure and expense even in soft hides. Love the drama! I am even more partial to the underlay concept-with just one extra layer of contrast hide, which I think would be softer, (cheaper/faster) with fewer layers to cut and stitch.</p>
<p>The smoke jacket in one natural color knocks me out. I like the clean lines and natural design. It is dynamic yet subtle.  I reach for subtle over bling every time.</p>
<p>Can we see a picture of the proto bag on the shoulder? The straps concern me, not sure if its placement or width or just that it is out of context as in not on the body. If the bag is near full, how do the straps fit and balance on a narrow shoulder?</p>
<p>Cant wait to see the next installment.<br />
Kaaren</p>
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		<title>By: kpotenti</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/prototype-bag-style-4216-4217/comment-page-1/#comment-15779</link>
		<dc:creator>kpotenti</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Jul 2009 15:11:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/?p=4518#comment-15779</guid>
		<description>For 4217 I would use some combination of hides A &amp; B; I&#039;m a big fan of B, the black and white embossing is very chic.  For 4216 I would go with the black and red from the choices offered, though I think black with purple flames would be cool.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For 4217 I would use some combination of hides A &amp; B; I&#8217;m a big fan of B, the black and white embossing is very chic.  For 4216 I would go with the black and red from the choices offered, though I think black with purple flames would be cool.</p>
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		<title>By: ken simmons</title>
		<link>http://www.fashion-incubator.com/archive/prototype-bag-style-4216-4217/comment-page-1/#comment-15778</link>
		<dc:creator>ken simmons</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Jul 2009 15:05:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fashion-incubator.com/?p=4518#comment-15778</guid>
		<description>Kathleen,
Make a tiny little bag shape and cut leather or colored paper and glue up these mock ups to test color combos then test market the little paste ups and see which combination is most apealing when put together. 

I would make the flame bag black with the tips of the flames yellow, and the rest red. 

I would use the top grain and the suede side of the same piece of leather to have a monochrome but differing textures for  the sunburst pattern.  It looks a bit Deco.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kathleen,<br />
Make a tiny little bag shape and cut leather or colored paper and glue up these mock ups to test color combos then test market the little paste ups and see which combination is most apealing when put together. </p>
<p>I would make the flame bag black with the tips of the flames yellow, and the rest red. </p>
<p>I would use the top grain and the suede side of the same piece of leather to have a monochrome but differing textures for  the sunburst pattern.  It looks a bit Deco.</p>
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