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You do NOT want a small business exemption
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Christina in CA
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pamela wrote:
The main question is how are you, a small crafter, different from a large manufacturer if a small child gets sick from a lead item you sell? How would the government handle this? It's ok for the small crafter to make the handmade jewelry that has lead beads but not the large companies? All it takes is one kid to eat something and get sick or die, which is exactly what happened that caused all this.

Pam


Ok, that's fair enough, I suppose. In that case, I would say that it is the testing requirements that are unreasonable - not the actual standards that have been put in place. I would personally like to see a situation in which the original producer of each material can pass their certificate of compliance along to buyers - similar to what is already in place for flammability standards in fabric.
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blizzard77
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alison Cummins wrote:
blizzard77,

On another thread you listed several things that you wanted to see in the CPSIA legislation that would enable you to demonstrate that you comply with safety standards.

Now you are saying that you do not wish to comply with safety standards, and that your customers seek you out because you do not comply?


I am (and actually have already) been willing to comply w/ safety standards to the best of my ability. However, one of the risk factors ( besides whether a substrate is likely to have lead or not) is how many of a certain product get made. A WAHM who makes an OOAK item is lower risk simply because there is only ONE of her item out there, not 500. Should that be taken into account? Maybe.

My customers (like everyones' customers!) are for the most part unaware of this legislation. However, most choose to buy from me over box stores, well-known brands, ect, simply because I am willing to make them OOAK and nearly-OOAK items. That's my market right now. Am I convinced that I make low/no-risk products? Yes, definitely. Will I have proof in a few weeks. Yes. Will my customers care? No. But they will care that I will have to discontinue making custom items.
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Vesta
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Joined: 23 Dec 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ding ding ding ding ding!

This is the type of answer I think we need for small manufacturers:

Quote:
I would personally like to see a situation in which the original producer of each material can pass their certificate of compliance along to buyers - similar to what is already in place for flammability standards in fabric.


I don't think we can mandate cheap tests (although approving the XRF gun would be a good step), and I don't think exemptions based on size or revenue is true to the spirit of the law. But with a combination of component testing and accepting certificates from suppliers, I think it would relieve the pressure on the smallest manufacturers and crafters. Then manufacturers could start bombarding their suppliers with requests for certifications, and they would have to start complying (run one test on a batch of parts, then post the compliance certificate online for their buyers to download).

This is the kind of thing we should be clambering for.
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amyruth
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 5:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But what about exemptions for certain types of fabric, like the flammability exemptions?

There are a lot of 100% organic fabrics out there. And I'm hoping the 100% poly fleece that I have a massive stack (or 3) of would be considered safe...
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Vesta
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 5:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, just because the fabric is 100% certified organic doesn't actually address the lead issue at all. However, if it's processed to GOTS standards or certified Oeko Tex, then you're good. It's the dying and printing that introduces lead. And there was just recently a recall of a set of doll clothes because of lead in the fabric, so we won't win on this one.
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amyruth
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2008 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vesta wrote:
Well, just because the fabric is 100% certified organic doesn't actually address the lead issue at all. However, if it's processed to GOTS standards or certified Oeko Tex, then you're good. It's the dying and printing that introduces lead. And there was just recently a recall of a set of doll clothes because of lead in the fabric, so we won't win on this one.


Oh no! I really never expected to have lead in fabrics that I buy! The wool interlock I get is OEKO certified as well as purewool but then they dye that... The rest of my stash, and the bulk of it, is fleece from Joanne's and Sy Fabrics. I was thinking to send maybe 5 samples of my fleece to get tested with the gun just to now for myself...

I wonder if the lead on the doll clothes came from the factory where they were sewn? I wash all of my fabrics before I sew with them b/c I know fabrics contain a lot of "stuff" that you don't want around your home anyway. I'm not that naive. Wink

But there is NO WAY I can afford to even have a $5 or $10 test for each and every yarn of fabric in my inventory. I have at least 100 if not more. Shocked

I guess I better start listing fabric for sale. Crying or Very sad
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Marianne58
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 9:14 am    Post subject: Just as confused as everyone Reply with quote

I make One of kind Items for women. Like it or not WE are all in this together and need to come together as one. Like any mass confusion that comes out of DC legislation there is a market for business to create scales - small, medium, large and I am hoping that that is what will happen with the testing facilities.

I do not have children BUT I believe that all children should be kept healthy and happy in their environments and parents need all of the reassurance that everything we manufacture is safe for them.

I am fighting as much as I can for all of Americans, and we should all band together and demand that if we are small or large testing facilities should charge us accordingly.
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Vesta
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I wonder if the lead on the doll clothes came from the factory where they were sewn?


No, no, no. What I'm saying is that the lead is in the dyes and inks and paints applied to the fabrics. It's not accidental; not a contaminant. And it's not associated with a particular type of fabric. You're safe with undyed fabrics, plain dyed fabrics are usually OK, but printed fabrics (even roller printed/"allover" printed) are suspect.
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Pamela
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can you clarify what would be an "undyed" fabric? All cotton jersey fabric starts off gray or "null" and is then colored. So is this considered "dyed"? What about woven cotton fabrics and georgettes? are they dyed?

I understand the part about rolled on paints etc.

Pam
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Vesta
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2008 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

By undyed, I mean that no coloring agent has been applied to the fabric, any fabric. So it will generally be that "natural" color (exceptions being things like colorgrown cotton, linen-colored linen, etc). If it is any color other than "natural", then it has been dyed.

I want to make clear that there is not an exemption for this type of fabric in the CPSIA. I am just trying to relieve people of their delusions that lead is not a risk in fabric.
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Kathleen F
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 11:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Read Mary Beth's opinion of small company exemptions ala the HTA. Her points are important for two reasons, Mary Beth and her huspartner own and operate a small wooden toy company (Hellowood in TN) and Mary Beth is an attorney. The cut to the chase version is the HTA proposal isn't viable for lots of reasons. MB is endorsing the NAM plan (NAM's response to the request for comments) with is what I will be working on today. I need to read it carefully, post it and make any notations. Rick has also endorsed the CA/IL laws as viable but I have to grok those in the context of NAM. In the meantime, read the NAM plan (pdf).
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KraftyMommas
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fantastic petition!!!!
I read it in complete and I agree wholeheartedly.
I wish I could sign it!!!
Thank you Kathleen.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I would agree that is a great letter. Says everything I am concerned about and those of others that I have read.
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Miracle
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 3:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Read the post and comments. About halfway through the PDF.

I agree with what both of you wrote about the divisiveness of the proposal of the HTA!
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Kathleen F.
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Joined: 08 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 20, 2008 3:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cross posted

After a careful reading, I am going on the record that we support the proposal submitted by NAM (National Association of Manufacturers) to the CPSC. As I've long argued is necessary, it is broad and inclusive.
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